RoboTaxi Rumors and EU Tariff Tango

[00:00:21] Hello everyone and welcome to Kilowatt, a podcast about electric vehicles, renewable energy, autonomous driving, and much, much more.

[00:00:26] My name is Bodhi and I am your host.

[00:00:29] And I'm actually recording this episode a few hours after I recorded the last episode on Sunday.

[00:00:38] Yeah, trying to make sure I hit those dates that I keep telling you I'm going to record and release on.

[00:00:46] I'm not doing a very good job, mostly on Fridays.

[00:00:49] I do a pretty good job on Tuesdays, but Fridays I don't do such a good job on.

[00:00:52] I'm not sure why, it's just there's lots of things going on in my life right now.

[00:00:56] So I thought, hey, why not double up so I don't miss Tuesday as well.

[00:01:01] So that's what we're doing here.

[00:01:03] Uh, let's see here.

[00:01:05] Let's go ahead and jump into our EV news.

[00:01:10] Ford's Q3 2024 sales numbers are out.

[00:01:13] They sold a total of 23,509 vehicles.

[00:01:17] That's 3,000 less than last year.

[00:01:21] So it breaks down like this.

[00:01:22] They sold 13,392 Mustang Mach-Es, 7,162 Ford F-150 Lightnings, and 9,256 Ford E-Transit vans.

[00:01:36] So, I mean, not as good as last year's Q3, but not bad when you compare those to all of the other EV sales numbers that we talked about on the last episode.

[00:01:48] Kia has some sales numbers as well.

[00:01:50] They actually had a record September for them.

[00:01:54] They sold 2,096 EV9s and 1,612 EV6s.

[00:02:01] Now, if you're listening to this and you're like, wait, what about the Kia Niro EV?

[00:02:07] I had the same question.

[00:02:09] And it turns out that Kia lumps all of the Niros together when it reports sales numbers.

[00:02:16] So it doesn't break out the ICE versus EV numbers in that regard.

[00:02:22] So while it would be interesting to have those numbers, we don't have them.

[00:02:27] Sticking with Kia, Kia has opened its first EV-only manufacturing plant.

[00:02:32] The plant is in South Korea.

[00:02:34] They plan on building the lower cost, not low cost, but lower cost EV3s and EV4s there.

[00:02:39] The plant will have the capabilities of building 150,000 EVs a year.

[00:02:46] California may require EVs to come equipped with bidirectional charging.

[00:02:51] Now, this is only a proposed bill.

[00:02:53] I don't think it's been signed as of this recording.

[00:02:56] But the goal of this bill is to potentially save someone's life during an extreme weather event,

[00:03:04] which is happening all too often and is going on right now here in the United States.

[00:03:11] But the scenario goes like this.

[00:03:13] If there's an extreme weather event and your power goes out,

[00:03:16] you can possibly run your home off of your battery for your car.

[00:03:22] And obviously, if you're able to do that, I think that that's great.

[00:03:25] But I'm not sure this bill is the best solution.

[00:03:28] I already mentioned I think the market's already headed this direction.

[00:03:33] But there are some other reasons why I don't think this is the best solution for this problem.

[00:03:38] Number one, the technology to allow you to power your house from your car is expensive to buy and it's expensive to install.

[00:03:48] It doesn't really help anyone who owns an EV but they're renting a house or they live in an apartment where they don't have this capability to power their domicile.

[00:03:58] It doesn't really address how it's going to help people who can't afford to buy an EV, right?

[00:04:04] So those people are kind of out of luck.

[00:04:09] Yeah, so overall, I think there are better solutions for a wider range of people to help them through an extreme weather event.

[00:04:17] I think bidirectional charging could definitely be part of this overall solution.

[00:04:24] But I don't think it's going to solve its problem by itself.

[00:04:26] Now, of course, you have vehicle to grid, which means it's going to help, you know, a bunch of these vehicles together could help support the grid, which is great as long as the grid is up.

[00:04:35] It doesn't really help if the grid is down because of down power lines or whatever.

[00:04:40] And then you have vehicle to load, which would be more helpful because even if you're in an apartment, you can run an extension cord out to your car and run your refrigerator or maybe a portable air conditioner.

[00:04:53] Or, you know, if you're a doctor, you can perform a vasectomy procedure without, you know, interrupting service.

[00:04:59] So that which is important, which actually happened shortly after the Rivian came out.

[00:05:05] A doctor used his Rivian to power his clinic so he could, you know, continue giving vasectomies.

[00:05:13] Yeah.

[00:05:14] So overall, listen, I don't want to poo poo the idea of bidirectional charging.

[00:05:21] I just don't think there's a real strong need for this bill because there are so many other things that have to go be put in place for this to work out.

[00:05:32] Now, it's definitely going to help out a few people, but those people have the means to buy an EV.

[00:05:40] They have the means and, you know, place to be able to install the equipment and buy the equipment.

[00:05:47] I just don't see that even if this bill does pass and is signed into law, I don't see that how that helps very many people.

[00:05:56] It's a small population of people.

[00:05:59] It's going to help.

[00:06:00] And they already have the the they already have it.

[00:06:04] You know, if they're going to buy it, they've already purchased it.

[00:06:08] So.

[00:06:10] Yeah.

[00:06:11] Moving on to the European Commission, the European Commission has approved the tariffs or import duties on Chinese vehicles.

[00:06:20] This was not a unanimous vote.

[00:06:23] Not even close.

[00:06:24] Ten countries voted for the the import duties.

[00:06:29] Five against with Germany leading with the strongest objection and 12 countries abstained.

[00:06:35] Now, if you're in Europe and you're like, man, I really want to buy a Chinese EV and I don't want to have to pay extra money on top of what it already costs.

[00:06:47] You have until November.

[00:06:49] And even better than that, the European Commission said that it could lift the tariffs if China addresses the EU's concerns, which would mean that China would have to come up with some, you know, world trade organization compatible plan.

[00:07:04] And address the they're using these this term injurious subsidies, which basically China is subsidizing these cars so they could be cheap.

[00:07:15] So China would just have to stop subsidizing them.

[00:07:17] So they so they're not so cheap and European automakers can compete.

[00:07:22] And then China would need to allow the European Commission to investigate, monitor and enforce anything.

[00:07:30] China is open to continuing negotiations.

[00:07:33] They say that these tariffs are not really helping anybody.

[00:07:37] And as a matter of fact, they're probably more harmful than they do good.

[00:07:41] So hopefully, you know, if if the European Commission can work this out or the European Union could work this out and level the playing field for everybody without using tariffs, that's a win.

[00:07:53] All right, everybody, that is it for our EV news segment.

[00:07:57] I do want to let you know, I mentioned last episode, I'm going to CES.

[00:08:01] CES is in Las Vegas.

[00:08:03] I'm going to drive my car there.

[00:08:04] So it's cheap.

[00:08:05] But I am going to stay in a hotel.

[00:08:06] Last year, I stayed with my friend Tony, which was very nice of her or not last year in 2023.

[00:08:12] But anyway, it was very nice of her to let me do that.

[00:08:14] Unfortunately, it's a long drive to her house.

[00:08:17] And it's not far away from the strip per se.

[00:08:21] It's just trying to get through all of the traffic.

[00:08:25] And I want to be able to go to these, you know, evening events.

[00:08:29] And I want to be able to kind of interact with folks who are part of this conference outside of the conference.

[00:08:37] So in order to do that, I'll be staying in a hotel.

[00:08:40] Hotels are not cheap there.

[00:08:42] But I am trying to do this as as inexpensively as possible.

[00:08:45] Like I upgraded my lavalier mics.

[00:08:49] I'm really excited about that.

[00:08:50] I bought some Anchor lav mics so that when I do interviews, they sound a little bit better.

[00:08:55] Hopefully.

[00:08:57] I still have my old lav mics just in case the new ones go down.

[00:09:01] But yeah, redundancy.

[00:09:03] Anyway, the whole point is, is this costs all this all costs money.

[00:09:06] So if you want to help out, go to patreon.com forward slash kilowatt or support kilowatt.com.

[00:09:11] You can pledge as little as a dollar and it, that still helps.

[00:09:16] So yeah, I'm really looking forward to it.

[00:09:19] I'm excited.

[00:09:19] I mentioned my co-host on beyond the post.

[00:09:22] Rob Dunwood is going to be there.

[00:09:23] So I'm looking forward to meeting Rob in person and who knows, Alison and Steve Sheridan might be there.

[00:09:29] And some other folks, I know there's somebody who listens to this show and supports the show who happens to be involved in CES.

[00:09:38] And maybe I'll get to meet them as well.

[00:09:41] Yeah, I'm excited about it and I'm looking forward to it.

[00:09:44] All right, let's get to our Tesla news.

[00:09:47] Good news.

[00:09:48] If you live in the UK and you're looking to buy a Model Y long range rear wheel drive,

[00:09:54] the good news is you can actually buy one now.

[00:09:56] You couldn't before.

[00:09:57] So you're going to pay about 46,990 pounds.

[00:10:03] That will get you a 373 mile range WLTP or 600 kilometer range.

[00:10:11] The bad news is you can no longer buy the Model Y standard range anymore.

[00:10:16] They have removed that from the order book.

[00:10:20] Meanwhile, back in the United States, you can no longer buy the Model 3 standard range rear wheel drive.

[00:10:25] And it seems like the reason why is because they used Chinese battery cells in that vehicle.

[00:10:33] And there's increased tariffs on Chinese products here in the United States.

[00:10:38] And goodness knows what's going to happen after the election.

[00:10:41] So as it stands right now, probably a good decision to remove that vehicle, at least until you can bring in some battery cells sourced from a place that isn't going to get you taxed and tariffed.

[00:10:54] And because they use Chinese cells, it was harder for them to access the $7,500 tax credit.

[00:11:01] But the kind of good news is that the Model Y or excuse me, Model 3 long range rear wheel drive is now the most affordable Model 3 at $42,500.

[00:11:14] If you choose to buy that vehicle, you'll get 90 miles more range.

[00:11:18] And depending on your income level, you could qualify for the $7,500 tax credit.

[00:11:23] So there's only $3,500 price difference between the two vehicles.

[00:11:27] And I know I shouldn't say it's only $3,500, but in the grand scheme of things, it's not that much.

[00:11:34] And you get a better car with more range and you get access to the tax credits.

[00:11:39] Let's move on to the Tesla Diner, Drive-In Theater, and Supercharger.

[00:11:44] This big, huge site in LA is coming along.

[00:11:48] They are currently installing V4 Superchargers.

[00:11:51] So they've been approved for 25 stalls.

[00:11:53] It looks like they can install more, but I guess right now it's 25 to start.

[00:11:59] This building is going to be super cool.

[00:12:02] It's all made out of aluminum and it looks like a spaceship.

[00:12:06] It's super cool.

[00:12:07] And I'm sure going here and eating and charging and watching a movie is going to be a lot of fun.

[00:12:12] I also feel really confident it's going to be kind of culty.

[00:12:16] But I think it's going to be a fun experience to go and do.

[00:12:19] So hopefully one day I'll be able to do that.

[00:12:22] And our next story is a little bit long here.

[00:12:26] And I have to preface this with, this is a story about battery cells.

[00:12:32] And I am not a battery expert.

[00:12:34] So let's start off.

[00:12:36] According to the information, Tesla is looking at introducing four new dry cathode 4680 battery cell variants.

[00:12:44] I cannot afford the information.

[00:12:47] So I am going off an article written by Simon Alvarez on Teslarati.

[00:12:52] According to the article, the four variants will be the NC05.

[00:12:56] These are internal names.

[00:12:58] The NC20, the NC30 and the NC50.

[00:13:03] The NC05 will be kind of like the most versatile and affordable of the four.

[00:13:09] It'll power things like the Robotaxi, certain variants of the Cybertruck, maybe the Tesla Semi.

[00:13:13] And then you have the NC20, which is more energy dense.

[00:13:17] And that will probably go into the more expensive vehicles.

[00:13:20] And then you have the NC30 and NC50, which will feature silicon carbon anodes, which will hold more lithium.

[00:13:28] Do not ask me any follow-up questions because I am just saying words without knowing what they mean.

[00:13:33] Again, I am not a battery expert.

[00:13:36] Now, having said that, I'm going to do my best to explain the difference between a wet cell cathode and a dry cell cathode.

[00:13:44] I've actually explained this before.

[00:13:45] And hopefully each time I explain it, we all understand it a little bit better, including myself.

[00:13:50] So based on what I can tell, the main difference is with the manufacturing process between a wet cathode cell and a dry cathode cell.

[00:13:58] When manufacturing a wet cathode cell, this involves a slurry of the battery cathode materials.

[00:14:05] And then there are solvents, binders, and conductive additives.

[00:14:09] This is all mixed into this really nasty slurry.

[00:14:13] The slurry then coats this metal foil to form a cathode layer and then is dried in an oven.

[00:14:21] So drying takes a lot of energy.

[00:14:23] It also takes a lot of time and can often be a bottleneck in the manufacturing process.

[00:14:28] While the cathode is drying, the solvent evaporates, but then that solvent needs to be recovered.

[00:14:35] You just can't let it evaporate into the air because it's toxic and inflammable and it's bad for the environment and bad for human health.

[00:14:43] So because of that, it needs to be recaptured, right?

[00:14:48] All of these things that I just explained make the wet cathode manufacturing process more expensive.

[00:14:58] So it takes more time, it's worse for the environment, it's worse for human health, and then it's more expensive.

[00:15:05] Not something you're really looking to do when you're manufacturing a product.

[00:15:09] So let's move to dry cathodes.

[00:15:11] When manufacturing a dry cathode, you don't need solvents at all, which is great because it's dry now.

[00:15:16] So the battery materials, binders, and conductive additives are all mixed into a dry powder.

[00:15:22] And this dry mixture is applied to the metal foil and then it is all rolled under high pressure to form a cathode.

[00:15:32] The benefit to this is there's a lower environmental and health impact because solvents aren't used.

[00:15:37] Drying is no longer needed.

[00:15:39] It reduces energy consumption when it comes to manufacturing and it makes manufacturing faster.

[00:15:46] And then that leads to obviously cost savings because it's lower energy use.

[00:15:51] It reduces the amount of equipment you need and the materials slash ingredients needed to make the cathode.

[00:15:57] And then there's some potential performance gains that dry processing can allow for a thicker electrode without cracking,

[00:16:05] which potentially, we'll say potentially, will increase energy density and battery life.

[00:16:10] So what does this mean to the consumers?

[00:16:13] Well, it means you're going to pay less for your EV.

[00:16:16] Lower battery costs can reduce the overall cost of the EV, making them more accessible to a broader market.

[00:16:23] There could be some performance enhancements, increased range because of the higher energy density, faster charging.

[00:16:31] And then the manufacturers will see increased profit margins.

[00:16:35] They'll also be able to hit their sustainability and environmental goals.

[00:16:39] They'll meet regulatory compliance, which is really good.

[00:16:44] Scalability, faster production supports scaling when you're trying to grow and meet demand.

[00:16:51] Now, just because you've developed a process doesn't mean you can scale it because that could actually be an actual challenge.

[00:16:59] You can't transition from those pilot lines to mass production without a bunch of technical hurdles you have to overcome.

[00:17:06] And then you also have the problem with the materials that you're using.

[00:17:12] Are they going to be compatible with the dry process?

[00:17:15] And if they're not, what do you need to do?

[00:17:17] What do you need to change to make that work?

[00:17:18] So there's a lot that goes into this.

[00:17:21] Again, I'm not a battery expert, but hopefully that helps you understand the difference between a wet cathode process or wet cathode and a dry cathode.

[00:17:32] I'm sure, you know, in another couple of months, maybe six months or so, we'll have this discussion again.

[00:17:39] And hopefully we'll be able to add a little bit more information as I learn more.

[00:17:42] And if you know more, send me an email, Bode, B-O-D-I-E at 918digital.com.

[00:17:48] Anyway, these new battery cells are supposed to be introduced sometime around 2026 or by 2026 is what it said in the article.

[00:17:56] So keep your eye open.

[00:17:58] We'll see what happens.

[00:17:59] There's already a Cybertruck being tested that's 100% dry cathode.

[00:18:03] So I don't think we're too terribly far away.

[00:18:06] Although, again, trying to move from pilot lines to production lines seems to be a real struggle, not only for Tesla, but for other companies as well.

[00:18:17] Now, we have our final story that we're going to get to, and this involves RoboTaxi.

[00:18:24] So RoboTaxi event is going to be on Thursday.

[00:18:28] So I thought I would talk about a couple of things that, a couple news items that were associated with RoboTaxi.

[00:18:36] One that's just kind of fun and goofy and one people may be reading too much into.

[00:18:42] So I'm going to do the one that people are reading too much into, I think anyway.

[00:18:45] First, Tesla Chief Information Officer Nagish Saldi is leaving Tesla.

[00:18:51] So over the last few months, he has been in charge of expanding Tesla's data centers in New York and Texas.

[00:18:58] One would assume that these data centers have a lot to do with RoboTaxi and the whole RoboTaxi rollout, at least in part, maybe not 100%.

[00:19:07] This has caused some concern to some online.

[00:19:10] I would not read too much into this.

[00:19:13] It may be an issue, you know, going forward.

[00:19:17] And it may not.

[00:19:19] Like, just because an executive leaves doesn't mean the whole company is going to fall apart.

[00:19:24] Lots of executives left this summer and Tesla's still cooking.

[00:19:29] We'll see what happens in a year or two, how they're doing overall.

[00:19:33] But I don't think this is as big a deal as everybody says it is.

[00:19:37] All right, now that we got that out of the way, let's talk about the fun one.

[00:19:40] There is a rumor that Tesla and McDonald's are in talks to collaborate in some way, shape, or form on something to do with RoboTaxi.

[00:19:49] And the most obvious collaboration would be delivering food, right?

[00:19:54] Makes total sense.

[00:19:56] The RoboTaxi shows at McDonald's.

[00:19:58] McDonald's employees put food in the RoboTaxi.

[00:20:01] The RoboTaxi takes it to wherever it needs to be delivered.

[00:20:04] People come out, get their food, eat their food, and the car goes on its way.

[00:20:08] Now, this rumor is all based on a post that McDonald's posted on X that shows a picture of a McDonald's bag with a receipt.

[00:20:20] And it's captioned, chat's about to pop off 1010.

[00:20:25] So again, the picture is a McDonald's bag on top of a desk.

[00:20:30] It looks like it's in somebody's bedroom or home office.

[00:20:33] And on the bag is a receipt.

[00:20:35] At the top of the receipt, it says 1010 in big letters.

[00:20:38] And the next line down, it says special item coming to a chat near you.

[00:20:43] And then just below that, it says valid at participating McDonald's.

[00:20:48] And then there's, you know, a McDonald's restaurant with a phone number.

[00:20:51] I called the phone number.

[00:20:52] It doesn't work.

[00:20:53] There's a date of 101024 at 12 p.m.

[00:20:56] I don't think that's the time of the RoboTaxi event.

[00:21:00] It's 1010 is when the RoboTaxi event is going to take place.

[00:21:03] But 12 p.m.

[00:21:03] I don't think is the time.

[00:21:05] And then below the time are the items in the bag.

[00:21:08] So the number one at the very top item is not a Big Mac, which some believe is a reference to Elon's not a flamethrower.

[00:21:16] And I would agree with that.

[00:21:19] And then you have a medium fry, medium sprite.

[00:21:22] And then it says, thanks for your order.

[00:21:24] W's in the chat.

[00:21:25] So I have a theory.

[00:21:27] And I'm not even saying this is true.

[00:21:28] But I have a theory that this is a collaboration between X, McDonald's, and Tesla.

[00:21:35] Right?

[00:21:35] So the chat part is probably coming from Grok, which is Elon's AI efforts.

[00:21:43] What company that falls under, I'm not really sure.

[00:21:46] But so chat is in reference to Elon's AI, wherever that falls into it.

[00:21:54] McDonald's is obviously providing the food.

[00:21:57] Tesla is providing the RoboTaxi.

[00:22:00] Having said all that, I'm still not 100% convinced that this is true.

[00:22:04] It might be.

[00:22:06] Listen, McDonald's and Tesla did.

[00:22:08] They worked on the Cyberspoon together.

[00:22:10] So there's a possibility that this is real.

[00:22:15] Although they worked on it without Elon's knowledge, apparently, in China.

[00:22:20] But anyway, I thought it was a fun story.

[00:22:23] What are your thoughts?

[00:22:24] You can email me an audio clip of your voice telling me your thoughts.

[00:22:28] And I'll probably put them on the show.

[00:22:31] Doesn't mean they're always going to go on the show.

[00:22:32] But probably would go on the show at some point in time.

[00:22:37] Like I said last episode, I'm trying to get some more points of view on this show than just mine.

[00:22:44] So you can email those to Bode, B-O-D-I-E, at 918digital.com.

[00:22:49] It's okay if you mess up and you have to do it multiple times.

[00:22:53] I can cut it up and put it together.

[00:22:55] You don't have to do that if you don't want to.

[00:22:58] And yeah, I feel really productive.

[00:23:00] I watched football today.

[00:23:01] I cleaned up a bunch of stuff.

[00:23:03] Sold some stuff on Facebook Marketplace.

[00:23:05] Recorded two podcasts.

[00:23:06] Edited part of one podcast.

[00:23:11] You know, saw my children.

[00:23:14] All three of them, including the 28-year-old who was here.

[00:23:17] Took them to breakfast.

[00:23:18] Very, very, very productive day today.

[00:23:20] But it is now 916.

[00:23:23] I need to shower because it's still 113 degrees here in Phoenix.

[00:23:29] And I am sweaty and gross.

[00:23:30] And then I need to go to bed.

[00:23:32] So I hope you all have a wonderful week.

[00:23:35] I will talk to you on Friday for sure this week.

[00:23:41] I swear on my fingers.

[00:23:43] Like, may my pinky break if I can't get the episode out on Friday.

[00:23:48] This week.

[00:23:50] Not every week.

[00:23:51] Just this week.

[00:23:53] You know, obviously with RoboTaxi and the news, it's advantageous for me to get this podcast out as soon as I can for that particular episode.

[00:24:05] Because, you know, that flower wilts pretty quick.

[00:24:09] And kind of behind the curtains, these kind of events drive downloads for sure.

[00:24:15] So I have a lot of reasons to get this episode out.

[00:24:19] Not the least of which is my pinky on my left hand.

[00:24:21] I need that pinky.

[00:24:23] It's really important.

[00:24:24] All right, everybody.

[00:24:25] I hope it's how I drink.

[00:24:28] And when I drink my drink because I am not an animal, my pinky sticks out.

[00:24:31] That's why it's so important.

[00:24:32] All right, everybody.

[00:24:33] I am going to leave because I can feel myself getting silly.

[00:24:37] I hope you all had a wonderful weekend.

[00:24:40] I hope you all have a wonderful week.

[00:24:42] And I will talk to you on Friday.